The USA was founded on Judaeo Christian values
“Lest anyone try to convince you that God should be separated from the state, our founding fathers… were believers. Hearing any leader declare that America isn’t a Christian nation… It’s mind-boggling to see some of our nation’s actions recently, but politics truly is a topic for another day.”
If we want to split hairs, the governor was correct that the founders overwhelmingly were believers. But were they Christians, and did they found a Christian nation? R. Albert Mohler Jr., president of the Southern Baptist Theological Seminary, mildly chastises both sides in the long-running debate:
“America is not Christian by constitutional provision or creedal affirmation — but its people are overwhelmingly Christian by self-affirmation. Thoughtful evangelicals will not overestimate the convictional character of this self-identification. Secularists ought not to overestimate its superficiality.”
But in Faith of Our Founding Fathers, Tim LaHaye, co-author of the Left Behind series, claims that Americans are being robbed of their spiritual heritage by revisionist secularists (Gregory Koukl disagrees, writing, “The sad fact of the matter is that cultural authority was not stolen from us; we surrendered it through neglect”). The Founding Fathers were not, as secularists claim, mostly deists or agnostics. Only a few were deists and even fewer agnostics. LaHaye’s Faith examines the values and beliefs of thirty-eight of the delegates to the Constitutional Convention. Through their writings, LaHaye makes a case that America’s founders built their nation on religious principles (though John Eidsmoe makes a more effective argument in the similarly-titled Christianity and the Constitution: The Faith of our Founding Fathers). Other authors trying to make the opposite case have ruled out some of the most compelling evidence — the letters and journals of the Founding Fathers. By affiliation with religious denomination, only three of the more famous founders — Benjamin Franklin, Thomas Jefferson and Thomas Paine — were in fact Deists, yet even Jefferson, who was raised as an Episcopalian, donated a significant amount of money to building Episcopal churches and even attended services in Episcopal parishes. It is significant to note that Jefferson had an Episcopal minister come to his bedside before he died. It was Franklin’s views which are usually considered the least orthodox of the founders, but even he attended church and tithed. But Franklin believed religion was a positive force in society, and he said, in a motion before the Constitutional Convention:
I have lived, Sir, a long time, and the longer I live, the more convincing proofs I see of this truth- that God Governs in the affairs of men. And if a sparrow cannot fall to the ground without his notice, is it probable that an empire can rise without his aid? We have been assured, Sir, in the sacred writings, that “except the Lord build the House they labour in vain that build it.” I firmly believe this; and I also believe that without his concurring aid we shall succeed in this political building no better, than the Builders of Babel: We shall be divided by our little partial local interests; our projects will be confounded, and we ourselves shall become a reproach and bye word down to future ages. And what is worse, mankind may hereafter from this unfortunate instance, despair of establishing Governments by Human wisdom and leave it to chance, war and conquest. I therefore beg leave to move-that henceforth prayers imploring the assistance of Heaven, and its blessings on our deliberations, be held in this Assembly every morning before we proceed to business, and that one or more of the Clergy of this City be requested to officiate in that Service.
So much for the separation of church and state… But there is a denomination, often overlooked by those who write American History texts, that was significant in the nation’s founding, though none of the major Founding Fathers were among its members. In an excellent essay which is part of his “Crash Course in Jewish History,” Rabbi Ken Spiro notes the influence of Jews on the Founding Fathers. One of their most important contributions to the American Revolution was that Jews financed a considerable portion of it:
The most important of the financiers was Haym Salomon who lent a great deal of money to the Continental Congress. In the last days of the war, Salomon advanced the American government $200,000. He was never paid back and died bankrupt. President George Washington remembered the Jewish contribution when the first synagogue opened in Newport, Rhode Island in 1790. (It was called the Touro Synagogue and it was Sephardic.) He sent this letter, dated August 17, 1790:
“May the children of the stock of Abraham who dwell in the land continue to merit and enjoy the goodwill of the other inhabitants. While everyone shall sit safely under his own vine and fig-tree and there shall be none to make him afraid.”
Note the reference to the “vine and fig-tree.” That unique phrase is a reference to the words of Prophet Michah prophesying the Messianic utopia:
But in the last days it shall come to pass, that the mountain of the house of the Lord shall be established in the top of the mountains, and it shall be exalted above the hills; and people shall flow to it. And many nations shall come, and say, ‘Come, and let us go up to the mountain of the Lord, and to the house of the God of Jacob; and he will teach us of his ways, and we will walk in his paths; for Torah shall go forth from Zion, and the word of the Lord from Jerusalem.’ And he shall judge between many peoples, and shall decide concerning far away strong nations; and they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruning hooks; nation shall not lift up sword against nation, nor shall they learn war any more. But they shall sit every man under his vine and under his fig-tree; and none shall make them afraid; for the mouth of the Lord of hosts has spoken it.
Rabbi Spiro points out that when the War of Independence broke out, there were an estimated 2,000 Jews living in America, yet their contribution to the cause went far beyond their numbers. Nearly every adult Jewish male fought on the side of the Americans in Charleston, South Carolina. And the first patriot to be killed in the war in Georgia, Francis Salvador, was a Jew. But the Jewish influence in the founding of the United States was deeply ingrained in the faith of the new nation:
The creation of the United States of America represented a unique event in world history – founded as a modern republic, it was rooted in the Bible, and one of its earliest tenets was religious tolerance. This is because many of the earliest pilgrims who settled the “New England” of America in early 17th century were Puritan refugees escaping religious persecutions in Europe. These Puritans viewed their emigration from England as a virtual re-enactment of the Jewish exodus from Egypt. To them, England was Egypt, the king was Pharaoh, the Atlantic Ocean was the Red Sea, America was the Land of Israel, and the Indians were the ancient Canaanites. They were the new Israelites, entering into a new covenant with God in a new Promised Land.
Not only in the reliance on the Old Testament was the Jewish impact on America evident, but also in the symbolism adopted by the young nation:
Numerous examples can be found which clearly illustrate to what a significant extent the political struggles of the colonies were identified with the ancient Hebrews. * The first design for the official seal of the United States recommended by Benjamin Franklin, John Adams and Thomas [Jefferson] in 1776 depicts the Jews crossing the Red Sea. The motto around the seal read: “Resistance to Tyrants is Obedience to God.” * The inscription on the Liberty Bell at Independence Hall in Philadelphia is a direct quote from Leviticus (25:10): “Proclaim liberty throughout the land unto all the inhabitants thereof.” * Patriotic speeches and publications during the period of the struggle for independence were often infused with Biblical motifs and quotations. Even the basic framework of America clearly reflects the influence of the Bible and power of Jewish ideas in shaping the political development of America. Nowhere is this more evident than in the opening sentences of the Declaration of Independence: * “We hold these truths to be self evident that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights, that among them are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.” Whereas, these words echo the ideas of the Enlightenment… without a doubt, the concept that these rights come from God is of Biblical origin.
Considering the rich contribution of Jews to not only the American revolution but the nation’s culture, it is clear that the United States is not just a Christian nation, but largely a Judeo-Christian one, or at the very least a nation founded on Judeo-Christian principles. And as such, it is unique in the world. Which brings us to the present day. Are we still a Judeo-Christian nation? According to a Newsweek’s own poll taken one year ago, a majority (62 percent) of Americans disagreed with President Obama’s statement that the U.S. is not a Christian nation. The majority of Americans who considered their country a Christian one was even higher during the Bush Administration at 71 percent. But look beyond religious denominations, and Newsweek’s survey confirms that we are overwhelmingly a nation of believers:
The number of Americans with faith in a spiritual being—nearly nine in 10—has not changed much over the past two decades, according to historical polling. Seventy-eight percent said prayer was an important part of daily life, an increase of 2 points since 1987. Eighty-five percent said religion is “very important” or “fairly important” in their own lives—a number that hasn’t changed much since 1992. Nearly half (48 percent) described themselves as both “religious and spiritual,” while another 30 percent said they were “spiritual but not religious.” Only 9 percent said they were neither religious nor spiritual.
David Waters, editor of On Faith, the Washington Post religion blog, writes that in her statement to the Women of Faith, Gov. Palin may have meant that a majority of Americans are self-professed Christians. We’re confident that she did not mean that America is a Christian nation in the way that Iran is an Islamic nation, that the primary purpose of America is evangelical or that the primary allegiance of every American is to Jesus. Or, she may have meant something else entirely, such as that America was founded by mostly Christians on Judeo-Christian principles, and it remains overwhelmingly a nation of the faithful, although the recent actions of its government clearly demonstrates that in the purview of foreign policy at least, those principles are no longer being applied. We can’t speak for the governor, but unless she says differently, we assume that the latter of those concepts was the essence of what she was talking about.
We are fortunate to have on-site an expert in matters of Christian dogma.
His Holiness rongrand I.
Let’s ask him about commandments 1-4.
Inclusive.
We do. Without a doubt.
The simple fact is Christianity is a sect of Judaism. For example, you can have Islam without Judaism. (Muslims prefer this as you know.) But, you can’t have Christianity without Judaism. We accept the Tanakh as God’s word. Muslims don’t.
In terms of Jesus, the things that he said make absolutely no sense without the teachings of Moses and the Hebrew prophets. That’s why Jesus came only to Jews.
No one else would have any context to understand what he meant.
And for Christians today, to really understand Jesus, we need to understand the Tanakh. …Moses, David, Daniel, Esther, Passover, the Temple. All of it.
Some Jews are just more comfortable pigeonholing Evangelicals as enemies.
They are impatiently waiting for the Southern Baptists to rip off the smiling masks and start screaming, “Fooled ya’, Jews! It’s into the ovens for you Christ killers!!”
I even detect a certain disappointment that it has yet to occur.
Plan on continuing to be disappointed.
You were born too late.
The current enemies of the Jews are Muslims and their liberal allies.
Tar Yag.
I have removed all your sentances that use the X word. I will ban you if you continue to use it. It is both childish and insulting.
Gideon Levy lives in a country he despises. He is free to leave, but prefers to stay and destroy what he hates. Levy personifies Haaretz…he is a malicious traitor:
The only democracy in the Middle East is perhaps unique, but it’s doubtful if it’s the real thing. (Point One – Levy views Israel as being a phony democracy) Results of a poll published in Haaretz yesterday reflect what has been known for a long time: a combination of ignorance, a basic lack of understanding and a fascist mood. (Point Two – most Israelis are fascists) An ill and dangerous wind is blowing toward a government that is threatened with collapse.
According to the poll, which was conducted by the Tami Steinmetz Center for Peace Research at Tel Aviv University, there is a clear, solid anti-democratic majority. It’s a majority that wants to punish people who expose wrongdoing by the military, and it’s not willing to allow human rights groups to operate freely. It’s a majority in favor of punishing those who call for a boycott on Israel, and it wants heavy sanctions against journalists who reveal information about immoral acts committed by the Israel Defense Forces. (Point Three – Most Israelis are so despicable that they want to punish those who seek to harm the country they love)
Punishing and punishing, and delighting in the silencing of the critics – that’s what the people want. That’s their opinion. Of all the real and manufactured dangers lurking against Israel, this is the greatest, most real and most immediate. (Point Four – The greatest threat to Jews is not Palestinian terrorists or Iranian nukes…it is Jews themselves)
Take accountant Haim Yoavi-Rabinovich in the Anat Kamm case. He called for the arrest and trial of Haaretz’s publisher, Amos Schocken, for blackmail and treason, no less. “Kamm is not a spy, she’s a traitor,” Rabinovich wrote, calling for Kamm to be punished accordingly, too. It can be assumed that in the view of people like him, an execution in a public square would not be an excessive punishment. (Point Five – Sounds good, but let’s at least start by arresting the seditious bitch…okay, Drama Queen?)
Rabinovich is not alone. His ideas are all over the Internet and have attracted plenty of support. But he’s not the problem. The likes of him exist in every proper, civilized society. The problem is that in the Israel of 2010 almost no system remains to halt this dark and ignorant Rabinovichism and defend freedom of expression, which 98 percent of the respondents in the survey, believe it or not, said is important to them. (Point Six – Israelis say the believe in free speech, yet oppose traitors exposing national security secrets. Evil evil Jews! And so hypocritical!!)
How Israeli it is to be (theoretically) in favor of freedom of expression yet in practice be so much opposed. You don’t need a poll. Most Israelis believe that democracy (only) means elections every few years, because it’s enough for a narrow majority of MKs to raise their hands in the Knesset in favor of every kind of crime and injustice to make it all right. Security is used as a cover for everything. (Point Seven – Paranoid bastards perceive threats to Israel? In which crack pipe did they find the idea that anyone hates the Jewish State?)There is a connection between the politicians’ flattery campaigns in the primaries and democracy; that anyone who dares criticize, expose wrongdoing, step out of line or voice a different opinion is destined to the same fate; that the majority can do whatever it wants and the minority must be powerless. (Point Eight – If only. Unfortunately, the leftist minority has the power to demonize and divide Israel, much to the benefit of those who intend to kill all the Jews…even the self-hating ones)
Most Israelis are fed up with any system of government supervision, which is the true test of the nature of government. To hell with the remnants of real journalism in Israel, and to hell with the Supreme Court, which doesn’t necessarily always do its job. And enough already with those treacherous human rights organizations. Let’s have an Israel without a High Court of Justice and without human rights groups like B’Tselem. (Point Nine – Whose human rights are you intent upon protecting? The human rights of people who murder four year old Jewish girls by smashing their heads into mush with rifle butts?)
Such an Israel is ready to move forward in the face of any threat. Israel is ready for a monster. Nothing will stop it. Every kind of violent and dangerous leader and every war crime will be welcomed here, welcomed by the stupid and ignorant. (Point Ten – It is your Palestinian cohorts who embrace monsters. Israeli leaders are too busy sending the Palestinians aid to emulate Frankenstein. Imaginary monsters haunt you, Levy, whereas real monsters gain your support…so let’s be done with your sniveling about “monsters”)
Our immune systems have long weakened. The press will be silent, and the Supreme Court will forgive. Meanwhile, protest slumbers and civil society, a concept on the rise in world politics, doesn’t exist. Go explain to the Israel of 2010 that the media’s role is to expose wrongdoing, the non-governmental organizations’ role is to warn us, and the Supreme Court’s role is to be a gatekeeper. Instead, all of them are to be punished. Go explain that the tyranny of the majority is no less dangerous than control by the minority. Go explain that democracy means unlimited, free criticism. (Point Eleven – Try this explanation: the media’s role has never been to pass state secrets to terrorists. The role of NGOs has always been to facilitate the murder of Jews. Your role is apparently to disparage the nation that provides you with freedom and to denounce the military that keeps your sorry ass alive)
All this is gone and forgotten. We have no one to instill these values. We have survived Pharaoh, and we will survive Iran, but not this problem. It filters down from within, threatening to bring everything down on the people. The current public atmosphere is the classic breeding ground, as if it were taken from the history books for cultivating savage regimes. There is no need for a military coup in Israel. The defense establishment has excessive control over most aspects of life. There is no need for a dictator, either. The tyranny of the majority is dangerous enough. (Point Twelve: You find yourself in what you consider to be a military dictatorship, and you are free to emigrate…yet you stay. Is that because you enjoy being persecuted? Or because you know that your allegations are grotesque lies for which you earn a handsome living?)
“Mr. Schocken, editor of Haaretz,” as Rabinovich ignorantly called him, will not be put on trial for now. And Anat Kamm will not be executed. But democratic government in Israel has already been put on trial, and the punishment is being delivered right in front of our eyes. (Point Thirteen: The punishment is that in an amazingly free and tolerant country like Israel, the price of liberty is enduring outrageous bullshit spewed by demagogic traitors like you. Israel is too good for you. And even if it were the unbearable hellhole you believe it to be, Israel would still be too good for you. In a world filled with despicable people, you have distinguished yourself as being amongst the most repulsive)
http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1166133.html
There is actually a very elementary halachic foundation for Tar Yag’s suppression of using words containing the idolotrous term “christ”.
For those attending a Daf Yomi shiur, recall what Sanhedrin 63:b stated a few weeks ago, regarding the mention of other deities by name.
For Hebrew readers, you will find this topic discussed here (original DOC format) or here (converted to HTML text). Page down to the subject titled “Hazkarat shmam shell yeshu v’shell muhamed.”
Ted I think you are being PC in reverse of our friends the liberals.
Christians contains the root Christ and Christ means:
Christ is the English term for the Greek (Khristós) meaning “the anointed one”. It is a translation of the Hebrew (M?šîa?), usually transliterated into English as Messiah.
The word is often misunderstood to be the surname of Jesus due to the numerous mentions of Jesus Christ in the Christian Bible. The word is in fact used as a title, hence its common reciprocal use Christ Jesus, meaning “Jesus The Anointed One”, or “Jesus The Messiah”. Followers of Jesus became known as Christians because they believed that Jesus was the Christ, or Messiah, prophesied about in the Tanakh (which Christians term the Old Testament).
The majority of Jews reject this claim and are still waiting for Christ to come ( Jewish Messiah).
Most Christians now wait for the Second Coming of Christ when they believe he will fulfill the rest of the Messianic prophecy.
The area of Christian theology focusing on the identity, life, teachings and works of Jesus, is known as Christology.
Orthodox Christian views
Teachings about Jesus and testimonies about what he accomplished during his three-year public ministry are found throughout the New Testament.
Usage of “X” for “Christ”
The word “Christ” and its compounds, including “Christmas”, have been abbreviated in English for at least the past 1,000 years, long before the modern “Xmas” was commonly used. “Christ” was often written as “XP” or “Xt”; there are references in the Anglo-Saxon Chronicle as far back as AD 1021. This X and P arose as the uppercase forms of the Greek letters ? and ? used in ancient abbreviations for ??????? (Greek for “Christ”), and are still widely seen in many Eastern Orthodox icons depicting Jesus Christ.
The Oxford English Dictionary (OED) and the OED Supplement have cited usages of “X-” or “Xp-” for “Christ-” as early as 1485. The terms “Xpian” and “Xtian” have also been used for “Christian”. The dictionary further cites usage of “Xtianity” for “Christianity” from 1634. According to Merriam-Webster’s Dictionary of English Usage, most of the evidence for these words comes from “educated Englishmen who knew their Greek”
Why do many orthodox Jews write xtians rather than Christians? For the same reason in Hebrew we don’t write the name of G-d and many like me abbreviate or hyphenate. Religious Jews don’t speak the Name Christ, write it as it denotes affirmation of Jesus being the Messiah or a diety. It is not meant to be disrespectful but to avoid blasphemy on the part of the Jew that he affirms that Jesus is the Messiah or god.
Check any site where orthodox Jews comment and you will see the same abbreviations. Besides as I have noted above The Christians themselves first coined the term and have been using it for over a 1000 years.
I nominate banning the letter “X”! It should be blotted out by putting a cross over it!
No! Wait!!!
The simple fact is that christianity is a deviant cult, originally derived from Jews who corrupted and abandoned their Judaism, and used Judaism as their crutch for legitimacy.
Hey! I just summed you up in one sentence pretty well there!
Were Bibi dead, I would guess that you are his gilgul, but Bibi being still alive and even PM I simply say: you are the same kind of people like him, or maybe you the gilgul of hermann cohen.
I appreciate The explanations. I am well aware that Christ is the greek word for the “anointed one”.
Here is where I am coming from. I have no interest in insulting Christians and I think that using the X word does. Everyone knows that Jesus Christ is the name used to identify who the Christians believe to be the Messiah. No Jewish person or would think it is synonomous with the Jewish messiah. Let us say he is the Christian Messiah. Similarly everyone knows that Christianity and Christians have to do with belief in Jesus Christ as the Christian Messiah.
Furthermore Judaism has a concept of who the messiah will be. Jesus was disqualified by virtue of the fact that he died. The messiah is expected to rule on earth. So the two concepts also vary.
Let’s face it both Christianity and Islam took our biblical narrative and basterdized it. By that I mean they took great licence over it and recast it. Calling Jesus, Jesus Christ is one manefestation of it.
From my point of viuew, anyone is entitled to believe what they want to believe and to name themselves and their messiah what they want. Looking at it from a legal point of view both Islam and Christianity would be guilty of the tort of passing off, i.e. they are passing themselves off as a version of us or something like that. It is too late to complain about it like MasDona;d complained about MAcDavid a few years ago.
Please, the Evangelical Christians are our friends. Show them respect.
Indeed, many are.
But evangelical christianity is definitely not.
Anti-Christianity is no more or less virtuous than anti-Semitism.
As a fervent opponent of the latter, I feel morally obligated to oppose fervently the former.
The circumcised pricks on this site who spew anti-Christian sewage should heed the following admonition:
This is what happened to the last anti-Christian bigot who teed off Bitch Queen Of The Jews.
Did you take stupid pills this morning?
Anti-Semitism is a hate of the Jewish people. Anti-christianity is a hate of the christian religion.
(Ayn snaps out of it)
No, I just do what you so obviously do.
So you hate the religion without hating the religionists.
(Shy remains oblivious)
Hopefully, the Christian readers of this blog realize that the site’s anti-Christian clique is louder than it is large.
If some bigot called Judaism a “deviant cult” I would be outraged, and even further outraged when he cravenly denied hating Jews.
Going out of your way to offend people who care about you is not only counterproductive…it is ignorant.
Let’s take our own Rongrand. Seems quite a nice and sincere guy.
In fact, go back and look what I said, which made you gripe against me in the first place. Maybe you’ll get a hint from there.
I believe people refer to this in English as “hate the sin, not the sinner.”
There are atheists who believe exactly that. As long as they don’t harm me, I can manage life with them. They aren’t necessarily “bigoted.”
I’d rather level with christians, unlike the way many of them bluff us.
Grab a hand mirror, Ayn.
Hi!! ayn
Hi Shy
Have you voted yet Shy?
Shy Guy don’t look now but this site is all about supporting Israel, whether you are a Christian, Jew or Muslim.
We all condemn anti-Semitism and likewise should condemn bashing other religions.
The past is full of hatred amongst religions and our Catholic Church was right up there as a major player causing the death of many fine people in the world. Although none of us were participants we must never let it happen again under any circumstance. It was not justified then and cannot be now. It must be avoided at all cost, the ball is in our court, we’re on the clock.
How, it must begin with us having respect and tolerance for others and other religions.
Although a Catholic and believe differently I have the greatest respect for Jews and Judaism, why because they are good people and Judaism teaches respect for G-d, family and neighbors, how bad is that?
Why do I support the building of the Third Temple, it shows their respect and love of G-d and to honor Him, how bad is that?
Just think if the world followed the Torah, we wouldn’t be in this lousy mess.
So why is he subjected to reading some bigot refer to his precious faith as being a “deviant cult”?
Insulting nice and sincere guys.
Not a manifestation of strong mental health.
Let’s hope that Netanyahu’s pessimism is fully justified.
He seems to respond obsequiously after being treated with contempt.
The hardliners in Likud should proceed accordingly.
I am not a Central Committee member.
Oh! I thought you were that close?
Really? Are you advocating no more negative comments on Israpundit about Islam?
Just plain ridiculous.
So let’s back up a little here.
I loathe christianity. I’m not Gaga (OK – for Ayn – Gaga) about Hindusim and Budhism either. But the big difference is the latter two don’t stalk and prey/pray on my people nor blame the world’s problems on the Jews for killing their man-god (and, yes, you don’t need to tell me that not all – perhaps not most – christians think like that – any more). Face facts: there’s not much for any aware Jew to like here.
Did you read me advocating a world-wide “crusade” against christians?
I find christian missionizing of my people the ultimate intolerance of my religion. Stop pinning the tail.
In that same sense, I respect many christians and those of other beliefs for precisely the same reason. Repeat: I never said otherwise.
That’s very nice of you. However, assuming you know the Prophets, you have a theological motive to promote this as well. So there’s some common ground here. I like common ground – but not at any price.
Your time is running out. What are you dawdling for?!
Bad link.
I am in close communication with Manhigut.
Your predictions of the vote later?
My lips are hermetically sailed.
But it really should have been SIS BAH BOOM. Think about it.
ted belman, you have the same ideology like BB.
just as BB is playing the strong man against authentic Jews and licks the boots of hussein, so you lick the boots of the followers of the religion of love, the so-called “lovers”, while you play the strong man against real Jews. you are as MISQEN as BB.
This discyussion got out of hand.
Israpundit has an agenda and that is to support Israel which includes those welcoming all who do. I will not tolerate any Christian bashing. Israpundit has put out the welcome mat for Christians and we must be good hosts. We must show appreciation of their support and good will.
I will not permit any other message.
And as I have said before, I expect Christians to show us similar respect and to not make any attemps at missionizing.
End of discussion.
Well Shy I won’t rub it in , so when is Moshe going to leave that nest of loser lemmings and help to build a real national
land of Israel party? His idea had merit might still have merit but not with Feiglin at the head. If he leaves the Likud I
might even join him . Time to start seriously thinking about Medinat Yehuda.
We get that. The ones who don’t leave pretty quickly.
In a weird way, it’s kind of a compliment when they go off. They know they can be completely honest with us and we don’t get offended. Irked a little, sure. But not offended. We don’t have that culture of ‘honor’ where insults have to be met with equally ferocious insults.
ted belman, the only people who are sharing your “values” are the “lovers” (i.e. the adepts of the sect of love), indeed if you lose them your definitely alone.
to summerise the discussion: belman was not able to give an example of a mythical Jewish-”…” value
so he closed the discussion as it is the way of all “intelligent” and “educated” people, like popes and other “lovers”