Ocean Guy puts his objection succinctly:
If you agree with Friedman that any land outside the Green Line should be Judenrein, then you're part fo the modern and tolerant majority. If you disagree then you're a Theocratic Settler... What a load of crap.
Well, actually Friedman doesn't blame it all on the Jewish extremists, but he adds them to the mix, in "
Remapping the Middel East, Maybe" (We could add this to his list of tedentious "Rules for reporting from the Middle East" in his
current column:"There is no problem in the Middle East that cannot be blamed on Israeli settlers." Actually that rule applies a lot better than some of his others.)
So how does Thomas work in Israel to this comparison? Easily:
What is happening right now in Iraq, Israel and Palestine is a new Churchillian moment. The contours and contents of these core Middle East regions are up for grabs, only this time these contours are not being redrawn by an imperial pen from above - and will not be. This time they are being shaped by three civilian conflicts bubbling up from below - among Palestinians, Israelis and Iraqis. As the Israeli political theorist Yaron Ezrahi puts it, "Three volcanoes are erupting at the same time. Lava is pouring out of each of them, and we are all waiting to see how it cools and into what forms."
Like the recent tsunami, this sort of tectonic movement of geopolitical plates happens only once a century. This is a remarkable political moment that you don't want to miss or see go badly. But that's what's scary; when borders and states emerge from volcanic activity, anything can happen. What all three of these cases have in common is that they pit theocratic, fascist and messianic forces on one side, claiming to be acting on the will of God or in the name of the primordial aspirations of "the nation," against more moderate, tolerant, democratizing majorities.
I won't argue that there are those among the Jews living in Judea, Samaria and Gaza who could be described as extremists. But to say that anyone who opposes or questions the Israeli withdrawal from Gaza is a member of a "theocratic, fascist and messianic" force is simply wrong. Thomas has two categories "theocratic, fascist and messianic" vs. "moderate, tolerant, democratizing." It's another one of his simplistic formulations that doesn't account for the many shades of grey that are there.
First of all there are those who point to a
recent observation of Gen Doron Almog that
We have stopped about 30 percent of hostile actions near the fence and 70 percent inside the territory through offensive actions. In addition to the fence, we must continue to gather intelligence throughout the territories in order to be able to intercept Palestinian terrorists.
In other words an Israeli presence in Gaza is necessary to stop the terrorists on the ground there. Gen Almog actually has experience as the military commander over Israel's southern territory that lends his judgment some credibility. And Thomas is sure that an Israeli withdrawal from Gaza is a good thing based on what experience?
That's point #2. Those of us who are skeptical of an Israeli withdrawal helping the peace process look at the experience in Lebanon. Israel withdrew from Lebanon, much in accord with Friedman's belief that it would bring peace on Israel's northern border and that if Hezbollah violated Israel's north afterwards it wouldn't have a leg to stand on. Well
Hezbollah hasn't exactly been shy on Israel's north and
Lebanon's army hasn't taken control of that country's south as it was obligated to according to UNSCR 425 and Friedman hasn't complained much. He's simply noted a time or two that Hezbollah hasn't launched any major attacks. But now that Hezbollah no longer has to defend its own turf, it has started playing a greater role in terror against Israel from Judea and Samaria. As noted terrorism expert
Matthew Levitt has observed (see I can name drop and confer expert status onto my sources just as well as Thomas can!):
Over the last three years, Hezbollah has steadily intensified its involvement in the Palestinian-Israeli conflict, gravitating from the provision of material support and training for Palestinian terrorist groups to the direct recruitment of Palestinian operatives under its own command and control. Among the activities Hizballah¹s Palestinian squads have conducted are arms smuggling, recruitment, attempted suicide bombings, sniper and roadside shooting attacks, preoperational surveillance of Israeli communities and army bases, and planned kidnapping of Israelis.[2] Most recently, according to Israeli intelligence, Hezbollah's Palestinian operatives were responsible for the August 12 suicide bombing in Rosh Ha'ayin that left one person dead and six wounded.[3]
So would Thomas expect Hamas in Gaza to go quiet once Israel left? Or does he believe that Israel absorbing a greater number of rocket attacks is somehow "moderate, tolerant, democratizing?" According an Israeli general,
as reported in Ha'aretz an Israeli withdrawal from Gaza will put 46 Israeli communities into rocket range? And in a warning that should make Thomas nostalgic
Avi Dichter the head of Israel's internal security agency believes that "If We Leave the Philadelphia Corridor, Southern Israel Will Become Like Southern Lebanon." Given the prescience he displayed in predicting the positive aftermath of Israel's withdrawal from southern Lebanon, you'd think that Thomas might show a little humility and at least acknowledge that an Israeli withdrawal from Gaza assumes huge risks and that some sober people may object to it on those grounds? Of course humility has never been Thomas's strong point.
A third point to consider is that there are those who are organized against Israel's proposed withdrawal have eschewed violence and stuck to time honored democratic traditions of civil disobedience, protests and getting out the vote. Yes the only popular vote - as opposed to a governmental vote - taken in Israel about the withdrawal rejected it. How is it again that those who oppose the government's plan are fascistic and not democratic?
Nor can it be shown that every or even most of those objecting to the withdrawal are messianic. For example there's
Datya Yitzchaki who wrote:
When people decide to uproot us, to destroy and demolish everything we have built within the walls of our lives - the special corners, the memories and the routine, the hours of joy and growing and togetherness - it is our legitimate right, and the right of our children to protest. Moreover, it is one of the basic tenets and supreme values of our right and place in this world - the veritable rock of Zionism's existence.
Are those the words of a wild eyed fanatic?
Thomas's comparison here is just plain stupid and insulting:
The Israeli daily Haaretz also reported that the main council of West Bank and Gaza rabbis issued a statement Thursday urging all Israeli soldiers to openly defy the state and declare their opposition to the disengagement plan, saying: "The order to dismantle settlements goes against the laws of the Torah and human morality. One should not assist this act." The Haaretz columnist Akiva Eldar reported that thousands of Jewish zealots - and Christians, too - are waiting in the United States for the call to join the struggle alongside the settlers in Gaza.
Sound familiar? It should. The week before, the Muslim militant group Ansar al-Sunna in Iraq called for all Iraqi Muslims to boycott Iraq's voting booths, decrying them as "centers of atheism," and added the warning that "the Mujahedeen will be attacking polling stations." Hamas and Islamic Jihad are boycotting today's Palestinian election, just as the main Sunni political movement in Iraq, the Iraqi Islamic Party, has vowed to do there. Osama bin Laden, for his part, declared that the laws of Iraq are "infidel" laws, and "therefore everyone who participates in this election will be considered infidels."
What will Ansar al-Islam do to enforce its beliefs? Hold protests? Or kill a few infidels? That's not what the Rabbinis from Judea and Samaria will do. And it's not what American Jewish and Christian zealots will do either. They will object and they will protest.
Thomas ends up with:
I do not believe that these militant messianists can actually win in Iraq, Israel or Palestine, but they can prevent the majorities in each country from forging any new pragmatic, tolerant power-sharing arrangements - and in the case of Israelis and Palestinians, new borders. Mr. Sharon is the strongest prime minister Israel could have right now, but even he is having problems pulling off this self-amputation of the Gaza Strip.
The contours of the Middle East in the 21st century are at stake here, much as they were in 1922. If the pragmatic forces can dominate in Israel, Iraq and Palestine, it will establish positive examples that will give others in the region the incentive and confidence to try to emulate them. If all three remain roiling volcanoes, slowly devouring themselves, the social contract among Jews that the state of Israel was built upon will start to come unstuck, and Iraq and Palestine will be held up as exhibits A and B for the case that in the Arab world, states can only be stabilized by despotism, never democracy.
Sorry but where's he been for the past eleven+ years. Israel did attempt powersharing and all and how was Israel rewarded? With moderation? Or violence?
There is a conflict in Israel right now. But it is a civil one not a military one. It will be settled one way or another through peaceful means. In Iraq and the PA the bad guys will settle things as they always do with violence. And of course, it's hard to tell who the good guys are in the PA when the leader of the moderates consorts with terrorists, promises to protect them and declares Israel to be the "Zionist enemy."
Crossposted on
Israpundit and
Doubting Thomas.
The Category Game
There's been a tendency for some to compare the two elections in the Arab world - one the recently concluded election of Mahmoud Abbas as president of the Palestinian Authority; the other the upcoming Iraqi election in about 2 1/2 weeks.
For example, a recent editorial in the Washington Post suggested that the success of the Palestinian election boded well for the positive effect that the Iraqi election would have on the situation in Iraq and. thus, should not be postponed.
In "A Tale of two Elections," Andrew Apostolou finds that for both their flaws Ayad Allawi is a better bet to lead his country to enlightenment than is Mahmoud Abbas.
Thomas Friedman blames it all on Jewish extremists.
Ocean Guy puts his objection succinctly:
Well, actually Friedman doesn't blame it all on the Jewish extremists, but he adds them to the mix, in "Remapping the Middel East, Maybe" (We could add this to his list of tedentious "Rules for reporting from the Middle East" in his current column:"There is no problem in the Middle East that cannot be blamed on Israeli settlers." Actually that rule applies a lot better than some of his others.)
So how does Thomas work in Israel to this comparison? Easily:
I won't argue that there are those among the Jews living in Judea, Samaria and Gaza who could be described as extremists. But to say that anyone who opposes or questions the Israeli withdrawal from Gaza is a member of a "theocratic, fascist and messianic" force is simply wrong. Thomas has two categories "theocratic, fascist and messianic" vs. "moderate, tolerant, democratizing." It's another one of his simplistic formulations that doesn't account for the many shades of grey that are there.
First of all there are those who point to a recent observation of Gen Doron Almog that In other words an Israeli presence in Gaza is necessary to stop the terrorists on the ground there. Gen Almog actually has experience as the military commander over Israel's southern territory that lends his judgment some credibility. And Thomas is sure that an Israeli withdrawal from Gaza is a good thing based on what experience?
That's point #2. Those of us who are skeptical of an Israeli withdrawal helping the peace process look at the experience in Lebanon. Israel withdrew from Lebanon, much in accord with Friedman's belief that it would bring peace on Israel's northern border and that if Hezbollah violated Israel's north afterwards it wouldn't have a leg to stand on. Well Hezbollah hasn't exactly been shy on Israel's north and Lebanon's army hasn't taken control of that country's south as it was obligated to according to UNSCR 425 and Friedman hasn't complained much. He's simply noted a time or two that Hezbollah hasn't launched any major attacks. But now that Hezbollah no longer has to defend its own turf, it has started playing a greater role in terror against Israel from Judea and Samaria. As noted terrorism expert Matthew Levitt has observed (see I can name drop and confer expert status onto my sources just as well as Thomas can!): So would Thomas expect Hamas in Gaza to go quiet once Israel left? Or does he believe that Israel absorbing a greater number of rocket attacks is somehow "moderate, tolerant, democratizing?" According an Israeli general, as reported in Ha'aretz an Israeli withdrawal from Gaza will put 46 Israeli communities into rocket range? And in a warning that should make Thomas nostalgic Avi Dichter the head of Israel's internal security agency believes that "If We Leave the Philadelphia Corridor, Southern Israel Will Become Like Southern Lebanon." Given the prescience he displayed in predicting the positive aftermath of Israel's withdrawal from southern Lebanon, you'd think that Thomas might show a little humility and at least acknowledge that an Israeli withdrawal from Gaza assumes huge risks and that some sober people may object to it on those grounds? Of course humility has never been Thomas's strong point.
A third point to consider is that there are those who are organized against Israel's proposed withdrawal have eschewed violence and stuck to time honored democratic traditions of civil disobedience, protests and getting out the vote. Yes the only popular vote - as opposed to a governmental vote - taken in Israel about the withdrawal rejected it. How is it again that those who oppose the government's plan are fascistic and not democratic?
Nor can it be shown that every or even most of those objecting to the withdrawal are messianic. For example there's Datya Yitzchaki who wrote: Are those the words of a wild eyed fanatic?
Thomas's comparison here is just plain stupid and insulting: What will Ansar al-Islam do to enforce its beliefs? Hold protests? Or kill a few infidels? That's not what the Rabbinis from Judea and Samaria will do. And it's not what American Jewish and Christian zealots will do either. They will object and they will protest.
Thomas ends up with: Sorry but where's he been for the past eleven+ years. Israel did attempt powersharing and all and how was Israel rewarded? With moderation? Or violence?
There is a conflict in Israel right now. But it is a civil one not a military one. It will be settled one way or another through peaceful means. In Iraq and the PA the bad guys will settle things as they always do with violence. And of course, it's hard to tell who the good guys are in the PA when the leader of the moderates consorts with terrorists, promises to protect them and declares Israel to be the "Zionist enemy."
Crossposted on Israpundit and Doubting Thomas.
Posted by David Gerstman at January 13, 2005 06:02 AM