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Two-way independence
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Comments
1
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yaakov kirschen
said:
A major way in which it's a one-way relationships is when it comes to prisoner release. the U.S. is free to ask Israel to release prisoners... but when it comes to Jonathan Pollard?...
Dry Bones
Posted by: yaakov kirschen on October 20, 2005 02:06 PM
2
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Ed D
said:
As a Conservative, I deem G. Bush as an embarressment to the United States of America. His peacock struting does not fool anyone with intelligence. The bad news is that he will hold the office for 3 more years which is time to allianate the rest of his allies, including Israel. If Israel elects Usi Landau as Prime Minister, he will tell Bush and Hill where they can stuff their demands. The US needs Israel more than the other way around.
Posted by: Ed D on October 20, 2005 03:08 PM
3
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Leonard
said:
I'm sorry guys - I beg to differ. It's a two way relationship - and long may it remain so. Remember Nixons airlift during the Yom Kippor War, and don't dismiss the vital financial and military support over the past 30 years that countered vast Soviet military support for the Arabs which was financed by an unlimited oil wealth. No America and Israel are natural allies with shared values and interests, but Israel isn't a satellite of America and there are times for Israel to stand firm and asserts its sovereign and independent right to self-defence and not cave into unwarranted demands such as now !
Posted by: Leonard on October 20, 2005 04:00 PM
4
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Ed D
said:
Leonard, I agree with you in some extent, but when all this was happening, G. Bush and Daddy were not presidents.
Posted by: Ed D on October 20, 2005 06:33 PM
5
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felix quigley
said:
I consider America and the EU to be creating a world empire and woe betide anything which gets in their way. The lesson of Yugoslavia is that they will use any methods and will install puppet regimes where necessary. Their big problem remains Russia and China which have the strength and strategic depth to resist the Empire. Look at another post on this site to see that the US is right now working behind the scenes and to get out of Iraq will leave behind a nuclear Iran. For Israel in THAT case what use their "alliance" with the CIA and America?
Posted by: felix quigley on October 21, 2005 06:38 AM
6
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Leonard
said:
Clinton was supposed to have been a friend of Israel's but the end result of the Peace plan he was fostering with Barak would have jeapardised the future survival of Israel. At least Bush has recognised the new facts on the ground and ruled out a Palestinian State during his Presidency which ends in 2009.
Posted by: Leonard on October 21, 2005 01:07 PM
7
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Ted Belman
said:
The problem is that the powers that be ie the State Department are determined to get Israel back tgo the green line. They always have been except when they didn't want the UN to create Israel. Presidents come and go but the State Department remains.
Nothing will change so long as the World, including the US, is dependant on oil. The US must commit itself to a program (similar to the Manhattan Project of Roosevelt or the Man on the Moon project of JFK) which would make US energy self sufficient within ten years. The US has the resources, it just needs the technology.
Posted by: Ted Belman on October 21, 2005 10:40 PM
8
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felix quigley
said:
Leonard
This is amazing to me! Until 2009 no Palestine State a la Bush. What evidence for this when everything I hear is their determination to push it through asap?
Ted
I just distrust your argument about oil. From my reading this guys family was antisemitic in the Thirties.
Further I see the inherent laws within capitalism moving towards a dictatorship of world power magnitude.
I am told by Bob that US is dependent on Chinese money to prop up defecit. What if they pull the plug!
I see a reason for the US supporting Sharia and an alliance of US with Islamofascism. There are a billion or so humans living under Islam. US as a world power would seek dictatorship of a kind. The democracy thing in Iraq is bunkum. The media is one vast conspiracy in the pay of Bush Blair with just the odd individual exception but if they want a salary they are soon wheeled in.
In this way of looking at things Israel becomes another spot on the map, hence the ruthlessness of Rice et al.
Also I do not agree with this counterposing of state against Bush. Rice IS Bush´s woman. This is often used as an argument for those who want to GO ON supporting America.
Posted by: felix quigley on October 22, 2005 05:54 AM
9
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Leonard
said:
Felix - I see your point. I have just accessed the White House website to get a vebatum as to what was said publicly between Pres. Bush & the PA leader - and its true he remains committed to the Road Map. I had yesterday read in Aljazeera that he was refusing to set a timetable for the creation of a Palestinian State - this seems to be borne out in his response to the last question when he dismisses timetables and expresses a hope that this will take place during his Presidency, but says if it doesn't he hopes that he will lay the foundation for such a State. I suppose I am painting an optimistic gloss on things.
I also accepted Ted Belmans interpretation that we need to findalternative sources of energy to make us more self-reliant. The concentration of oil resources in the hands of our enemies has boosted the Arab War Machine and threatens the West and the survival of Israel, and compromises the loyalties of potential allies.
Posted by: Leonard on October 22, 2005 06:52 AM
Two-way independence
Yoram Ettinger, YNET NEWS May '05
In many ways, Israel is the giver and the U.S. is the receiver
Statements made by and the conduct of Israel’s leaders since 1993 create the false impression that Israeli-American ties constitute a one-way relationship.
The presumption is that America gives and Israel receives, leading to Israel’s inferior position and the alleged compulsion to follow the State Department dictates.
However, Former Secretary of State and NATO forces commander Alexander Haig refuted this claim, saying he is pro-Israeli because Israel is the largest American aircraft carrier in the world that cannot be sunk, does not carry even one American soldier, and is located in a critical region for American national security.
On our 57th Independence Day, Israel and the United States enjoy a two-way relationship. Israel is like a start-up company that enjoys the kindness of the American investor, but yields much greater profits than the investment.
Every day, Israel relays to the U.S. lessons of battle and counter-terrorism, which reduce American losses in Iraq and Afghanistan, prevent attacks on U.S. soil, upgrade American weapons, and contribute to the U.S. economy.
Senator Daniel Inouye recently argued Israeli information regarding Soviet arms saved the U.S. billions of dollars. The contribution made by Israeli intelligence to America is greater than that provided by all NATO countries combined, he said.
Innovative Israeli technologies boost U.S. industries
Meanwhile, the vice president of the company that produces the F16 fighter jets told me Israel is responsible for 600 improvements in the plane’s systems, modifications estimated to be worth billions of dollars, which spared dozens of research and development years.
Israel’s utilization of American arms guarantees our existence, but at the same time gives U.S. military industries a competitive edge compared to European industries, while also boosting American military production, producing American jobs, and improving America’s national security.
Japan and South Korea, for example, preferred the “Hawkeye” spy plane and the MD-500 chopper, both purchased and upgraded by Israel, over comparable British and French aircraft.
Indeed, innovative Israeli technologies have a similar effect on American civilian and agricultural industries, which view Israel as a successful research and development site.
As early as 1952, U.S. Army Chief-of-Staff Omar Bradley called for the integration of Israel into the Mediterranean Basin area, in light of the country’s location and unique capabilities.
In 1967, Israel held back a radical Arab, pro-Soviet offensive, which threatened to bring about the collapse of pro-American Arab regimes and disrupt oil supply, thus severely undermining the American standard of living.
In 1970, Israel brought about the withdrawal of Syrian forces from Jordan, at a time when the U.S. was tied up by wars in Vietnam, Laos, and Cambodia, thus preventing the fall of the pro-American Hashemite regime and a possible domino effect that could have reached Saudi Arabia and the Gulf states.
Israel shares counter-terror lessons
The 1976 raid in Uganda that freed Israeli passengers of an Air France flight hijacked by terrorists provided America with a backwind in the war on international terror, while in 1977 Israeli intelligence provided the intelligence information that foiled Libyan leader Muammar Gaddafi’s plan to assassinate Egyptian President Anwar Sadat .
Notably, Sadat would later go on to make peace with Israel, paving the way for other agreements between Israel and the Arabs.
In 1982, Israel destroyed Soviet anti-aircraft batteries in Lebanon that were considered immune to American weapons. Israel promptly shared the operation’s lessons, estimated to be worth billions of dollars, changing entirely the global balance of power in the process and contributing to the Soviet Union’s eventual disintegration.
In 1981, Israel bombed the Iraqi nuclear reactor, providing the U.S. with the option of engaging in conventional wars with Iraq in 1991 and 2003 and preventing a possible nuclear war and a terrible price of thousands killed.
In 2005, Israel provides America with the world’s most extensive experience in homeland defense and warfare against suicide bombers and car bombs. American soldiers train in IDF facilities and Israeli-made drones fly above the “Sunni Triangle” in Iraq, as well as in Afghanistan, providing U.S. Marines with vital intelligence.
Without Israel, the U.S. would have been forced to deploy tens of thousands of American troops in the eastern Mediterranean Basin, at a cost of billions of dollars a year. Had Israel been located in the Persian Gulf, the U.S. would have been spared the need to send hundreds of thousands of soldiers to the region, thanks to Israel’s deterrence and operational capabilities.
Indeed, Congress leaders, Vice President Cheney, and Secretary of Defense Rumsfeld are aware of Israel’s unique contribution to U.S. interests. In fact, they all wonder why the post-1993 Israel does not use its impressive contribution as leverage, in sharp contrast to the pre-1993 Israel.
Yoram Ettinger is a consultant on U.S.-Israel relations, Chairman of Special Projects at the Ariel Center for Policy Research and frequent contributor to Yedioth Ahronoth
Posted by Ted Belman at October 20, 2005 01:06 PM