1. Ed D said:

The term "military" also means the unit that features soldiers, sailors or others representing a recognized nation, whose goal it is to conduct war, defense as applied to that particular nation. This military also has the obligation of wearing a uniform as recognized by the International treaty on war.

2. Dan Barkye said:

Smith's reply only emphasizes the seeming futility of the attempt to try to convey to others, which are in essence strangers to our cause, the real pain, harm, hurt, and trouble that we have with the "bodies" that he describes as "military" and we, as "murderers".

But, this is exactly the art of propaganda - the ability to bring home, to bring across, a particular point of view in such a way that sways the listener/reader to your side.

This is what we should have in mind always: "How to do it?" How to reach the hearts and minds of strangers and to switch them to our side.

3. Larry Shapiro said:

I have often complained to the the New York Times about it calling suicide bombers, militants. Unlike the U.S. soldier reported in your story,I have never received an answer. Yet referring to Hamas and all the other Palestinian terror groups as miltary wings doesn't bother me because they are a miltary engaged in what they say is resistance to the occupation. The fact that they don't fight by any known rules is besides the point.The main issue today is the whitewashing of Hamas by the Times, and as I saw today, Fox News and I fear the Bush Administration. This is a far greater concern because Hamas has been front and center with its goal of ridding the Middle East of Israel. Let's concentrate on asking the media to be truthful in its reporting of Hamas and its goals and forget about what words the media uses to describe them.

4. kuhnkat said:

If you or anyone you know still subscribes to the NYT, that should be the FIRST place you should start to correct their Propagandistic publishing.

Stop giving your enemies money!!!!

5. Shelley said:

Dan wonders, "how to reach the hearts and minds of strangers". I probably qualify as a stranger. I am not Jewish. But I have done my research and read the history of both sides. It has been an intense journey and has taken a lot of time. The language of the "Palestinians" and their supporters is provocative and shrill, even hysterical. It's the facts though that are the most compelling and the Palestinians and their supporters obscure the facts, lie (not news) and use emotive language and graphic images which are very appealing to a younger generation that have been raised with TV, movies, and now the Internet. For what it's worth, I think Jewish organizations need to use some of the same tactics to supplement the facts. Don't be so nice and polite! So, something of each is required.

I have found maps to be very instructive.

6. hjghygiy said:

kl;grjpbopejomp de

7. pamela said:

Ok Shelley...now I don't know where the hell you got your info from but im pretty sure it was from a propagandic jewish newspaper,jewish news programm or maybe your just a jew pretending that your not to make a point....I would like to point out to you that the media is ONLY in favor of Israel, shows barely Nothing of what the palestinians are going through. Now calling Bil Laden a terrorist is a given but hamas and palestinian groups are resisting occupation....for your info, there are jewish arabs and non arabs who have lived in the middle east far before the holocaust and most of them are still there. whether in lebanon, Iraq, even Iran...don't contradict me on that, I know jewish people who live there...the point is that most jews claim that the land is their right but its not, its the right of those who are from there not some homeless european jews who no european country wanted to take in and to whom belfour promised a land in PALESTINE if they helped them in the war. these are the facts...go educate yourselves and learn about real history...no one is happy about innocent civilians dying and yet you talk about a minority of palestinians that show happiness when people are killed but u seem to forget that those people have families and histories and that maybe, just maybe you don't know that their brothers, sisters, fathers and sons were killed by jews...9/11...everyone knows that the Mossad knew about it and oddly 7000 jews who work there don't show up at work that day...there are some reports saying that the CIA is furious and is investigating...oh and shelly, just to alleviate the burden of your ignorance, I have a million articles and facts that I can show you to prove to you that you don't see all the truth on tv but only suicide attacks but never what provoqued them in the first place!!

8. Dan Barkye said:

I commend you, Shelly, for your well meant advices, which are correct and to the point. Thanks!! Many! More so b/c you're not Jewish.

Pamela, you poor, bewildered, well meaning soul. No pun intended, really, inspite of the sarcastic note. I mean what I said, but not ironically so. And why am I saying it? Well, b/c of the fundamental mistake you make re our historical right to this land, and I'll explain in a few sentences why is it OUR historical right and no one else's, and b/c of the astounding, incredible, outlandish assertion implied in your last sentence, namely that the suicides are justifiable - b/c they were provoked. Unbelievable!!

The Historical Right that the Jewish Nation has for the land of Israel:

- We were exiled, we didn't leave it b/c we so fancied;
- For 2k yrs we reassert w/o respite in our prayers (this pt isn't made as a religious one, but just to bring the message home, okay?) "If I forget thee, Jerusalem, may my right be forgotten!" (meaning 'the right arm'), so we didn't renounce the right we have for this land;
- The whole world and its rulers (historical facts) knew of this vow we made daily for thousands of years;
- Some people came, saw no one around, and decided, in a manifestation of utter insolence and impunity, to make it their land;
- We came back and claimed back our fatherland, our motherland, our ancestral land, the land of our nation and religion and culture, the first and original craddle of all the West civilization and religion AND that of Islam;
- Now, the ones who took our land say what you say: "We were here and so it's ours!"

Here, allow me to differ and to tell you and them that it is not so, this land is ours to the end of time, and no distortion and misrepresentation of the facts can turn them on their head.

FYI, even al-Qaeda, the ultimate fundies of Islam, in an attempt to justify the conflict w us, say (very recently, I believe that I read it in Debka) that the Jews are the owners of the land, but b/c they (the Jews) are unwilling to make sacrifices and do not fight for it, it is their (al-Qaeda's) duty to do so and to claim it as their own. Followed me? Good!

The Suicidal wave of so-called liberation fanatics:

- So you excuse them on the pretext that they were provoked to do so, b/c they were taken to task on account of their unlawful, unjustified claim for the land of Israel, right?
Well, read the piece on the Historical Right of the Jews for Israel.

Thank you for the attention, Pamela!

9. Bill Narvey said:

To Pamela,

I am not so kind as Dan Barkye when he suggests you are well meaning.

About the only two things you said that I can agree on is your acknowledging that Bin Laden is a terrorist, which deserves no more credit than if you said said the sun rises in the east and that there is a Jewish community in Iran.

Your other claims and alleged facts are not in any history and current affairs books and articles that I have read.

Your statement, "just maybe you don't know that their brothers, sisters, fathers and sons were killed by jews...9/11...everyone knows that the Mossad knew about it and oddly 7000 jews who work there don't show up at work that day" repeats a conspiracy accusation that even the most ardent Jew hating Muslim leader and Muslim national leader, save perhaps Ahmadinejad of Iran, has disavowed and acknowledged as utter nonsense.

Utter nonsense, born of an unquestioning support of Palestinians and an anti-Israel, if not out and out anti-Semitic mindset is how I would describe your entire post.

If however, you have a million articles and facts to present as you claim, to support your accusations and assertions of fact, present those that you think are the most compelling, but cite your source so your alleged facts can be verified.

10. pamela said:

Well, people people...I know you got all excited and now your gonna use the same old excuse of anti semitism and jew hatred which is absolutley NOT the case. I actually dated a jew and I live in a jewish community with many friends...so please dont make this abotu hatred or racism cos its not...i love jews...I think there funny, smart and compassionate...but THIS is about facts and history. The Belfour promise is taught in history books to high school students...thats where I got my sources from. The fact that the ENTIRE world acknowledges that the israeli presence is in OCCUPIED territories except for...hmm.....lets see....ISRAEL AND THE U.S....the different electorial candidates for the upcoming canadian election even ALL said that we follow the WORLD in saying that these lands are oocupied except for the refusal of the U.S. and Israel to acknowledge that. Now Dan, thanks for your recap but all what you stated is pure theological statements that you may convince some of our american ignorants who know nothing about history but I know that the entire area from palestine to lebanon to syria to etc. was all called bilad al sham and the arabs' original descent are pheonicians,badou, etc.. so the arabs most certainly have a right to their land...now the fact that G-D promised you the land does not mean that you have a right to it right now. If true, then G-D will give it to you in time...as for your Bin laden comment...please stop with the propaganda...I have all the arab and jweish tv networks inclduing al jazeera...ur statement is just non sense ...just dont beleive anything you read...oh and for the record...I was watching on my satellite an israeli network and a RABBI was on the show...it was bein g subtitled in english and he said the jews are suffering still because of all the blood they shed over the years...we are in a land that doesnt belong to us...God promised us the land at the end of the world...anyways I wont waste any more of my precious time trying to convince but the 9/11 is not a propaganda by the iranian president..in fact he has nothign to do with it...I have never even heard him say anything about the subject..its on DATELINE uh....if any of you watch some TV on NBC...
SHALOM

11. pamela said:

Oh and don't ever mention the massacres of KANA, SABRA AND CHATILA, JENIN CAMP in which the UN aid workers were not allowed in by the Israeli governement...but no your government is all for peace and love!!! why dont we ever talk abotu jewish hatred towards arabs...its odd to me....You all bash Spielberg because he showed the movie with nothing but objection but no...u hate the arabs so much that any light shed on them and their misery is just pure anti semitism....give me a break!! No one hates you, its your governement that is doing all the wrong...illegal settlements..when they are being kicked out of their homes you cry and scream that jews are being kicked out of their houses...well about those palestinians that are kicked out of their homes and lands??????
why can,t you people accept that there should be a JUST middle in which no wall is needed and each of both people can live side by side in peace and harmony...and dont give me BS about suicide attacks...you and I both know that once a FAIR agreement is made...they will stop...They have actually for a while until u killed their paralyzed hamas leader...and many others after that...so its like the question which came first? the chicken or the egg...this will never stop until you admitt that EVERYONE has a right for freedom, a land and homes.

12. Bill Narvey said:

Pamela,

What planet did you say you were from?

13. Pamela said:

Oh Bill, truth hurts doesnt it? but I know we will drown in your fabricated lies again when half of the israeli people know and acknowledge that you are occupying territories that are not yours...but I guess having nothing else to say except for that condescending comment of yours means that you acknowledge it 2.

Shalom